[X] My Assistant

To be added to the whitelist for "rough translation" you need at least:

• A mod power of 10
• Three existing gallery comments that fulfill the tag requirements

To be added, make a post in this thread linking to the comments you made. Existing whitelisted users and/or moderators will then validate that your posts are valid and constructive before you are approved. A history of non-constructive or discourteous posts beyond the submitted three may also disqualify you from the whitelist.

The post immediately following this can be edited by a moderator to change the whitelist. Each line must start with the user's UID and should be followed by the user's name and which source/target languages they are qualified for. The parser ignores everything past the initial number, as well as any line that doesn't start with a number. Changes can take up to an hour to take effect.

You may be removed from the whitelist if you use the tag beyond its stated purpose, provide supporting comments that are not constructive or are discourteous, or tag languages not listed with your entry.

Tag vetoers are automatically whitelisted and should not be included.

### This is the actual whitelist used by the system, and can be edited by a moderator. Do not put anything else in this post. Except for this line. ###

2323 Sakura (test account)
41509 Nomake Wan (JP > EN)
850945 Mr_Person (JP > EN)
1419096 cutegyaru (JP > EN)
1495064 Crystalium (JP > EN)

This post has been edited by Shank: Aug 1 2022, 18:14

Would like to submit 3 example galleries for consideration where I have left comments:

1) http://ehentaihip.com/g/2092277/0f33d2858d/
2) http://ehentaihip.com/g/2090047/ce30f02009/
3) http://ehentaihip.com/g/2092089/d292bd1569/


I think they are "polite" enough in nature, and describe legitimate errors, but if some of them considered nitpicks, or debatable, I might be able to find other examples in the galleries (or if not, I could look for other galleries).

Edit: It should be clear from the referenced galleries, but this is for consideration as JP->EN

2nd Edit: Thank you. And yes, I was able to tag the "rough translation" tag on the galleries.

This post has been edited by Crystalium: Jan 20 2022, 06:14

Just asked firew (a translator I trust) if he'd check the comments
1 & 2 seem fine
3 was almost too nitpicky, but still comes under "incorrect meaning"
I'm just going to make sure you've properly split it by bubbles then I'll add you if no problem

Edit: seems fine, added. I don't particularly remember your name in the comments during my poor grammar sweeps, so no historic bad comments I'm aware of at least. Since you are the first one, can you please confirm you are correctly able to tag it. You may need to wait for an hour.

2nd Edit: Thank you. And yes, I was able to tag the "rough translation" tag on the galleries.

Great, cheers for that.

This post has been edited by Shank: Jan 20 2022, 06:16

Would like to submit 3 example galleries for consideration where I have left comments:

1) http://ehentaihip.com/g/2092277/0f33d2858d/
2) http://ehentaihip.com/g/2090047/ce30f02009/
3) http://ehentaihip.com/g/2092089/d292bd1569/
I think they are "polite" enough in nature, and describe legitimate errors, but if some of them considered nitpicks, or debatable, I might be able to find other examples in the galleries (or if not, I could look for other galleries).

Edit: It should be clear from the referenced galleries, but this is for consideration as JP->EN

2nd Edit: Thank you. And yes, I was able to tag the "rough translation" tag on the galleries.

Just wanna point out that these are perfectly formatted examples, and pretty much exactly what the tag is meant for. Highly encourage every applicant to use this as a template.

EDIT: yes, move this to the talk page.

This post has been edited by cutegyaru: Jan 20 2022, 07:44

I think I did the formatting fine, but as Shank noted, it might not be totally the best in terms of the type of errors that we should be remarking on (like, in the third gallery, several of the errors were indeed errors, but they are the "who cares" sort of errors; and maybe we don't really think those sort of errors are what we are really looking to remark on). I am open to a discussion as to having some more general guidelines or examples for what sort of errors we should be aiming for (to avoid nitpicks and the like).

{I apologize if this is not the place to really discuss this. I can move to the tag suggestion thread or whatever for discussion if need be.}
{Edit: Moving that discussion over to the other thread}

This post has been edited by Crystalium: Jan 20 2022, 08:10

Submitting three example galleries for JP->EN whitelist consideration.

http://ehentaihip.com/g/2119777/b28931ece9
http://ehentaihip.com/g/2096717/9bc911ecc1
http://ehentaihip.com/g/2092140/bd18a20f80

If any of these are considered invalid as examples due to 'nitpicks' or other considerations I would be more than happy to submit additional content.

Just checking something, but in the meantime, we have two whitelisted members who are also translators (Unless I'm mistaken in believing Freudia is a translator?), so either he or Crystalium can confirm your comments.

That aside, and although you posted extra so it doesn't really matter for your count, but I'd probably not count something like

Page 7 Panel 3
This translation: "M-" "More...!"
Japanese text: もっと もっと…ください…っ
Author's intent: "More!" "More...please...!"

If the average reader isn't going to care about the difference and it's basically the same thing, not sure it's worth "fixing".

Thank you for the input. I'm not sure how this thread is supposed to go since it's brand new, so I will try to keep discussion to a minimum. That actually is why I decided to do more on that particular gallery; because I wasn't sure how far a 'nitpick' exactly would be. In that specific instance, the problem I noticed was that the translator completely omitted half of what the author wrote, which is why I included it.

But this sort of thing is good; it shows where the boundaries should be. And since this is a brand new tag, it will of course have teething issues like these. Again, thank you very much.

Discussion is probably unavoidable. It shouldn't matter so long as its on topic, that comments need to be verified invites discussion to begin with so it's basically expected.

The difference is likely from my perspective as an average reader, compared to a translator who has reason to even notice. Seems to me to be at the level of just an alternative translation (compared to how you'd do it) rather than something that makes a gallery annoying or difficult to read, or has a different meaning. Referring to just that one line, not the entire list. It's not like something like that can't be included, but I don't think they should add to the presence count if its of that level.

One of the examples Nomakw Wan provided has already been updated, good thing it happened before tag accuracy could take a hit from it.

This means we've achieved what would have been an accuracy drop from updates before we've seen any misuse of the tag.

Submitting three example galleries for JP->EN whitelist consideration.

http://ehentaihip.com/g/2119777/b28931ece9
http://ehentaihip.com/g/2096717/9bc911ecc1
http://ehentaihip.com/g/2092140/bd18a20f80

If any of these are considered invalid as examples due to 'nitpicks' or other considerations I would be more than happy to submit additional content.

These look valid to me.
・First one, even if someone considered some of them as nitpicks, had more than 10 blatant errors, so valid. (the uploader fixed them by now, but it was valid critiques at the time of posting the comment)
・Second one is valid (only potential "nitpick" is the stammering one, but I do agree it is an error to omit the stammering).
・Third one has 6 blatant listed errors. I also feel the other five are erroneous although I don't know if one would consider them too minor or not (namely the 3rd & 4th ones with the omitted word and quotation emphasis respectively; the 5th one being a long vowel romanization issue; the 8th one maybe could be argued as translator's choice although I do agree Nomake Wan's translation is literally correct, the 10th one making the Japanese text more plain by reducing "gobbles up a vibrator" to just "wearing a vibrator"). That being said, I can tell this gallery should qualify, since I see blatant errors on the coming pages as well. If some of the errors he listed are considered too minor, he can just add the ones from the next page or two and he'll hit the quota uncontroversially since I can see multiple blatant errors even on the very next page).

This post has been edited by Crystalium: Jan 22 2022, 23:34

One of the examples Nomakw Wan provided has already been updated, good thing it happened before tag accuracy could take a hit from it.

This means we've achieved what would have been an accuracy drop from updates before we've seen any misuse of the tag.

Agreed, it is good to see a comment without even needing the tag was enough.

These look valid to me.
・First one, even if someone considered some of them as nitpicks, had more than 10 blatant errors, so valid. (the uploader fixed them by now, but it was valid critiques at the time of posting the comment)
・Second one is valid (only potential "nitpick" is the stammering one, but I do agree it is an error to omit the stammering).
・Third one has 6 blatant listed errors. I also feel the other five are erroneous although I don't know if one would consider them too minor or not (namely the 3rd & 4th ones with the omitted word and quotation emphasis respectively; the 5th one being a long vowel romanization issue; the 8th one maybe could be argued as translator's choice although I do agree Nomake Wan's translation is literally correct, the 10th one making the Japanese text more plain by reducing "gobbles up a vibrator" to just "wearing a vibrator"). That being said, I can tell this gallery should qualify, since I see blatant errors on the coming pages as well. If some of the errors he listed are considered too minor, he can just add the ones from the next page or two and he'll hit the quota uncontroversially since I can see multiple blatant errors even on the very next page).

Kind of relying on you over if its good enough or not based on his comment as it stands, not in the future. He's added since you said that you think they are erroneous enough, but it shouldn't be added on the gallery if the current comment isn't good enough.

@Shank,
The comments as they are were enough for me. I was just elaborating for the sake of the discussion on types of errors since you yourself made the comment

That aside, and although you posted extra so it doesn't really matter for your count, but I'd probably not count something like

Page 7 Panel 3
This translation: "M-" "More...!"
Japanese text: もっと もっと…ください…っ
Author's intent: "More!" "More...please...!"

If the average reader isn't going to care about the difference and it's basically the same thing, not sure it's worth "fixing".

In terms demonstrating Japanese comprehension competency in terms of being added to the whitelist, I have no question it is demonstrated; and similar to my own third example gallery, there is still “incorrect meaning” or wrong nuance in the examples, so they are still errors. I was just point out that some of the errors could be debated as being of a "minor" type.

My comment about other pages was only to say that if we wanted further 100% blatantly wrong and strikingly indefensible examples that nobody could argue as being merely minor, the following pages would definitely supply him with that material. Of course we should not add the tag if the actually enumerated examples are not satisfactory enough. I want to be clear that I was not suggesting otherwise. I am just trying to be transparent with how I am evaluating things early on so that if I or someone else includes certain types of errors in our lists that people think should be avoided as being too minor for tagging, that we learn to avoid including those errors in our 10-count early on, if need be.

This post has been edited by Crystalium: Jan 22 2022, 23:54

Well, so long as you are sure on it, and we are all keeping in mind that we aren't trying to tag this on everything that isn't the absolute pinnacle of all translations, then it's fine. Those of us that can't read runes need to rely on you to be right about your assessment.

I'd like to think in cases where the meaning is generally the same, then it's good enough.

As an aside, I forgot to mention, ta for going beyond doing the bare minimum in the comments, nomake. Although doing more than the minimum isn't required, it is always odd to see comments for a so called "constructive" tag, often prefaced with "I only did the bare minimum to be able to tag poor grammar", etc. It'll be great fun for a tag to qualify, get updated, no longer qualify, get a new comment for 10 more, qualify again...

Edit: And it seems we can manage to get the current whitelist to approve names themselves, so my involvement will probably be limited to only updating the list going forward, bar enforcing:

A history of non-constructive or discourteous posts beyond the submitted three may also disqualify you from the whitelist.

and

You may be removed from the whitelist if you use the tag beyond its stated purpose, provide supporting comments that are not constructive or are discourteous, or tag languages not listed with your entry.

This post has been edited by Shank: Jan 23 2022, 03:58

・Third one has 6 blatant listed errors. I also feel the other five are erroneous although I don't know if one would consider them too minor or not (namely the 3rd & 4th ones with the omitted word and quotation emphasis respectively; the 5th one being a long vowel romanization issue; the 8th one maybe could be argued as translator's choice although I do agree Nomake Wan's translation is literally correct, the 10th one making the Japanese text more plain by reducing "gobbles up a vibrator" to just "wearing a vibrator"). That being said, I can tell this gallery should qualify, since I see blatant errors on the coming pages as well. If some of the errors he listed are considered too minor, he can just add the ones from the next page or two and he'll hit the quota uncontroversially since I can see multiple blatant errors even on the very next page).

Agreed, it is good to see a comment without even needing the tag was enough.
Kind of relying on you over if its good enough or not based on his comment as it stands, not in the future. He's added since you said that you think they are erroneous enough, but it shouldn't be added on the gallery if the current comment isn't good enough.

I do not think it is fair for me to get put on the whitelist if I didn't actually meet the requirement, since it means I wouldn't have validly tagged the gallery in question either had I already been on the whitelist. I understand "demonstrating competency," but we should be focusing on the spirit of the tag itself, since what qualifies as an 'error' was a primary concern among many users here as well as staff members. Yes, we are in very early days, but that's exactly why discussion like this is critical for the tag's development and to foster a productive environment around using it.

As such, I have edited the questionable gallery above's comment to include add additional "egregious" errors so that it may properly qualify.

This being said, I honestly think that in the spirit of improving galleries, taggers should aspire to complete a page at a bare minimum. As an example, let's say that in a 20-page gallery you check 2 pages, and in 2 pages, you find 9 errors. On page 3 there are 4 errors. Rather than merely listing a single error on page 3 in order to reach the "minimum 10 errors" requirement, you should list all 4 that are present on page 3.

I realize this may not be the discussion for the whitelist thread, but I'm putting it out there.

That he updated it wasn't your problem, it qualified at the time of you making the comment

Discussion on what counts or doesn't count is fine. If its in relation to approving someone, or what should qualify for approval, it can be posted here, if its in relation to something already tagged, it can be discussed here /index.php?showtopic=254552

This post has been edited by Shank: Jan 23 2022, 04:33

Nah, I wasn't referring to the gallery that got updated before I got checked. I meant the third gallery in my list, which Crystalium deemed to have only 6 truly qualifying errors out of the required 10. That's the gallery I updated the comments on so that it may meet the minimum standard.

That said, I also confirmed that I can now add the tag, so all good.

Great to hear

Though he qualified you for the 3rd gallery as well, roughly speaking. We can only go off whitelisted translators approving comments, outside of the obvious stuff. We'd get nowhere if we don't trust the people already on the whitelist, without reason to doubt otherwise.

Nah, I wasn't referring to the gallery that got updated before I got checked. I meant the third gallery in my list, which Crystalium deemed to have only 6 truly qualifying errors out of the required 10. That's the gallery I updated the comments on so that it may meet the minimum standard.

That said, I also confirmed that I can now add the tag, so all good.

Like Shank said, I still did consider your third entry valid as it was. I was just bringing up the topic of “should we count debatably “minor” errors” again. That being said, after your edit, you definitely have 10 or more uncontroversially blatant errors listed, so it definitely qualifies now if anyone had any issue with “minor errors”.

Edit: And it seems we can manage to get the current whitelist to approve names themselves, so my involvement will probably be limited to only updating the list going forward

What is the process for that, if it is in place?

This post has been edited by Crystalium: Jan 23 2022, 06:21